Why aren't Haitians Latin?

John Fay at Irish Eagle mentions a letter to the editor of the Miami Herald which pointed out that Portuguese-speaking nations such as Brazilians, for example, weren't "Hispanic". In the course of noting that this was the reason for popular use of the more inclusive term "Latino", it occurred to me that while it would be reasonable to infer that the latter term embraces speakers of all Latin tongues, in practice, it refers exclusively to speakers of Spanish and Portuguese.

The island of Hispaniola contains two countries: Haiti and The Dominican Republic, the former Francophone, the latter Spanish-speaking. So far as I can tell Dominicans are, like their fellow Caribbeans from Cuba, considered to be Latinos, while those from the western half of the island, like other French-speaking Caribbeans, aren't.

Comments

[John]

People from Quebec are also not considered Latinos.

[Hugh Green]

while it would be reasonable to infer that the latter term embraces speakers of all Latin tongues, in practice, it refers exclusively to speakers of Spanish and Portuguese.

Or their descendents, like J-Lo. Perhaps the term Latino in English, which I presume comes from Latinoamérica, was first used self-referentially by Spanish-speaking immigrants to the US from the south?

In this scenario, the fact that Haitians spoke French and not Spanish probably precluded them from the use of Latino, even though the idea of 'Latin America' was a product of Napoleon III's imperial ambitions.

That's my guess, anyway.

[Frank McGahon]

Or their descendents, like J-Lo.

I'd say that, going by her accent, Ms Lopez can speak Spanish fairly well and I reckon that any descendents who were exclusively anglophone would only qualify for the tag if they had a Spanish surname. So, perhaps Charlie Sheen isn't a Latino but his brother Emilio Estevez is?

Perhaps the term Latino in English, which I presume comes from Latinoamérica, was first used self-referentially by Spanish-speaking immigrants to the US from the south?

Perhaps, but it probably acquired currency because it allowed the inclusion of Brazilians (free-floating rationales and all that).

In this scenario, the fact that Haitians spoke French and not Spanish probably precluded them from the use of Latino,

But this doesn't explain why Portuguese-speaking Brazil is included. Maybe they could have used the term Ibero-America instead...

[Frank McGahon]

People from Quebec are also not considered Latinos.

Canada is probably too cold to be considered "Latin America"!

But there are plenty of countries right in the middle of what we consider the "Latin America" zone which appear to be excluded, such as the Guyanas (Guyana, French Guiana & Suriname) and the non-hispanophone Caribbean islands

[J.Cassian]

I have a book called A History of Latin America by George Pendle (Pelican, 1980s) which claims: "In general usage...'Latin America' means the twenty independent republics which arose in the territories in this area [i.e. the Americas south of the US] that once belonged to the Spanish and Portuguese empires, and the old French colony of Haiti."

[Frank McGahon]

What about Martinique, or French Guiana?

[Frank McGahon]

It seems that "Latino" doesn't map exactly onto Latin America. There are roughly three (overlapping) sets of Hispanophones in the US:

1. Immigrants or descendents of immigrants from Hispanophone countries in Central and South America

2. Immigrants or descendents of immigrants from Spain

3. Native Hispanophones, in places like Colorado and New Mexico

I reckon that the term "Latino" in America embraces all of those along with the Brazilians.

[J.Cassian]

What about Martinique, or French Guiana?

Dunno. I presume so.

By the way, I think the Brazilians are also known as "Luso-Americans", but I don't think anyone's going to go round calling them "lusos" (too close to another word in English).

Didn't Napoleon III try to play up the "hey, we French are Catholic Latins just like you" angle when he tried to install Emperor Maximilian in Mexico? I thought he was trying to create a Latin/Catholic counterweight to the "Anglo-Saxon" Protestants of the USA. The Mexicans didn't take to the idea, of course.

[J.Cassian]

Oh God, I've just realised I should have read what Hugh Green wrote before posting...

"I'm a Luso, baby, so why don't you kill me?"

[Stan]

Have folks forgotten that the reason why the island as a whole was called Hispanila? Everyone spoke spanish(after getting rid of the natives and slavery) until half of the island was SOLD to the French. And it was ONLY for 100 years!

Creole--what folks speak is a mixture of FRENCH, SPANISH, delect of African Language and Native Islands that were there.

It's amazing to me, but not surprisingly that these "LATINOS" would pick and chose WHO are what base on skin color ( yeah I said it)and now picking on "spanish" language.

Latinos are product of slavery! Yeah I said it and it's not BLACK HISTORY MONTH!

Here's a site to check up on!
http://www.discoverhaiti.com/history00_1_1.htm

I AM PROUD to be HAITIAN and I'm proud to be LATINO! So to everyone esle:

in spanish:
No puedes escoger a tu familia

in portuguese:
Você não pode escolher sua família

in french:
Vous ne pouvez pas sélectionner votre famille

YOU CAN NOT PICK YOUR FAMILY!

[TM]

If Haiti was the first Latin Americans country to win there indepence then why don't some people aknowledege the ppl as Latinos? Im proud to be haitian and Dominican. LATIN PRIDE

[Sylent]

Haitians arent considered b/c the anglo-americans are ignorant...

[Wild Pegasus]

I'd say that, going by her accent, Ms Lopez can speak Spanish fairly well

Don't be fooled by accent. There is a growing dialect of American English having a Spanish accent, even though the speaker doesn't know, or barely knows, Spanish. Lopez does in fact speak Spanish, but her accent is no longer a guide.

- Josh